It is a real Carcharodontosaurus tooth? Morocco KemKem area

[LauraMedea]

Hi, I'm a new member to this forum and new to fossils. I'm trying to learn to distinguish the numerous fakes from real fossils and while searching the web, luckily I found your forum which has many open topics about it. I apologize if my English is not perfect, but I am Italian and I will try to explain myself as best as possible. Given my obsession with dinosaurs, I recovered this Carcharodontosaur tooth. Being quite large, 3.54in., and having bought it at an auction from a private collector at a fairly low price, I was wondering if in your opinion it could be a fake or restored. I already tried with acetone to see if any surface color came off, but it remained intact without loss of color. Weighs 80g (0.176lb). The description reported the usual origin from Morocco, Hamada KemKem area. Could you help me understand if it's natural or not please? Unfortunately I discovered your forum after the purchase, I will not make the same mistake for future purchases. Thanks so much to anyone who can help me

[rocket]

when I have a close look on the pics for my opinion it is a good one. Seems to have some color on the tip and perhaps less restauration.

Does it have overall serration? Currently there are lot on the market with restaurations and colored / covered with brown colored Paraloid B72. Horrible, we have seen a lot on the last shows...

[Phos_01]

2 hours ago, LauraMedea said:

Hi, I'm a new member to this forum and new to fossils. I'm trying to learn to distinguish the numerous fakes from real fossils and while searching the web, luckily I found your forum which has many open topics about it. I apologize if my English is not perfect, but I am Italian and I will try to explain myself as best as possible. Given my obsession with dinosaurs, I recovered this Carcharodontosaur tooth. Being quite large, 3.54in., and having bought it at an auction from a private collector at a fairly low price, I was wondering if in your opinion it could be a fake or restored. I already tried with acetone to see if any surface color came off, but it remained intact without loss of color. Weighs 80g (0.176lb). The description reported the usual origin from Morocco, Hamada KemKem area. Could you help me understand if it's natural or not please? Unfortunately I discovered your forum after the purchase, I will not make the same mistake for future purchases. Thanks so much to anyone who can help me

Welcome to the forum! 

It's not a bad tooth , to start! to give you an idea, my first Carcharodontosaurus was in worst shape as this one. As you begin to investigate and study on various channels like this forum you will learn more and more what quality and autenticy is in fossils, you will also learn that its rare, very rare and usually comes with a high price. Its up to the collector if you wants to go for high-end items, or just like to collect, and is satisfied with a general 'ok' fossil but wants to collects as much species as possible. 

To come back at this tooth. The bottom area is pretty good. The tip seems to have some kind of bebree attached to it, and looks like a crack that has been glued about 3/4 of the tooth going up. Also the very tip looks restored / added to me.  Worst case you have some carved serrations towards the tip. You already used Acetone, thats good, but also a risk, if this was indeed a restoration or fabrication tooth you would lose it and it would be permanently gone. You can try with the Acetone to remove the small parts of marnix and sand that are still attached to the tooth. One other thing that would help you out allot is using a UV light, that could showcase the added alternations usually it becomes more dark in the uv light , like a stroke of paint, or glue.

[LauraMedea]

 

1 hour ago, rocket said:

when I have a close look on the pics for my opinion it is a good one. Seems to have some color on the tip and perhaps less restauration.

Does it have overall serration? Currently there are lot on the market with restaurations and colored / covered with brown colored Paraloid B72. Horrible, we have seen a lot on the last shows...

Thanks for the reply, the serration is visible on both sides of the tooth although very worn. I attach other photos where perhaps you can see better. The only point where it is completely non-existent is on one side of the tip (I highlighted the missing serration segment in red) while on the other side it is present up to the apex of the tip.

[LauraMedea]

19 minutes ago, Phos_01 said:

Welcome to the forum! 

It's not a bad tooth , to start! to give you an idea, my first Carcharodontosaurus was in worst shape as this one. As you begin to investigate and study on various channels like this forum you will learn more and more what quality and autenticy is in fossils, you will also learn that its rare, very rare and usually comes with a high price. Its up to the collector if you wants to go for high-end items, or just like to collect, and is satisfied with a general 'ok' fossil but wants to collects as much species as possible. 

To come back at this tooth. The bottom area is pretty good. The tip seems to have some kind of bebree attached to it, and looks like a crack that has been glued about 3/4 of the tooth going up. Also the very tip looks restored / added to me.  Worst case you have some carved serrations towards the tip. You already used Acetone, thats good, but also a risk, if this was indeed a restoration or fabrication tooth you would lose it and it would be permanently gone. You can try with the Acetone to remove the small parts of marnix and sand that are still attached to the tooth. One other thing that would help you out allot is using a UV light, that could showcase the added alternations usually it becomes more dark in the uv light , like a stroke of paint, or glue.

Thank you so much for the informations, this forum can help many inexperienced people like me to avoid making wrong purchases and to learn a lot about fossils, I'm happy to have found you! I have already tried with UV light but my inexperienced eye doesn't help me understand if there is any tampering, I just tried to take some photos under UV light, maybe you can see what I can't individuate. Sorry but it's really hard to take decent photos under UV light, I hope they can be useful anyway.

[rocket]

thanks, nice pics

Looks like a real and good one, great addition for your collection 

[LauraMedea]

10 minutes ago, rocket said:

thanks, nice pics

Looks like a real and good one, great addition for your collection 

Thank you very much !! I hope to expand my collection as best I can, also based on my economic finances, without fattening the pockets of counterfeiters! The only way I can do it is to study and learn from those who know more than me, this forum and the people who interact are very important to me because they can help me a lot.

[BirdsAreDinosaurs]

Impressive tooth! Most of it is real. But I am quite certain the very tip is not, it is just too pointy for a typical Carch tooth. Some areas are covered up, such as the area without serrations near the tip. Might be a crack or just feeding wear they were trying to hide (I dont know why they sometimes do that, feeding wear is a cool feature showing the tooth was actually used).

 

Applying a bit of aceton in some cases is not enough to reveal tampering with these teeth, as the material used sometimes is very hard. You could try cleaning up the tooth and removing the restorations, but be careful, you might end up with a worse looking tooth.

[LauraMedea]

3 hours ago, BirdsAreDinosaurs said:

Impressive tooth! Most of it is real. But I am quite certain the very tip is not, it is just too pointy for a typical Carch tooth. Some areas are covered up, such as the area without serrations near the tip. Might be a crack or just feeding wear they were trying to hide (I dont know why they sometimes do that, feeding wear is a cool feature showing the tooth was actually used).

 

Applying a bit of aceton in some cases is not enough to reveal tampering with these teeth, as the material used sometimes is very hard. You could try cleaning up the tooth and removing the restorations, but be careful, you might end up with a worse looking tooth.

Thanks so much for the directions! How could I clean it without ruining it? I don't want to make a mess...Is there a topic reserved for cleaning fossil teeth based on how they were treated? Or do you always use the same technique to eliminate counterfeits?

[Fitch1979]

Hi there.. I had a couple of hundreds or even thousands in my hands of these through the years. I am not sure.. first bet .. I think it is a composite.  As said by other members.. I bet top part is not original.

 

More pictures in daylight would assure a good assesment. From a distance and close up, from where that crack starts

[LauraMedea]

20 minutes ago, Fitch1979 said:

Hi there.. I had a couple of hundreds or even thousands in my hands of these through the years. I am not sure.. first bet .. I think it is a composite.  As said by other members.. I bet top part is not original.

 

More pictures in daylight would assure a good assesment. From a distance and close up, from where that crack starts

HI! Thank you very much for your reply! Tomorrow I'll try to post some photos under sunlight so, as you say, it will be easier to notice any problems. Thanks again

[LauraMedea]

17 hours ago, Fitch1979 said:

Hi there.. I had a couple of hundreds or even thousands in my hands of these through the years. I am not sure.. first bet .. I think it is a composite.  As said by other members.. I bet top part is not original.

 

More pictures in daylight would assure a good assesment. From a distance and close up, from where that crack starts

Hi, here I am, unfortunately it's very cloudy today, but I took some pics outside anyway, maybe, if it's sunny in the next few days, I'll add more to see

the conditions better of the side without serration up to the tip and if so what "cleaning" to try to do if you deem it necessary .

[Fitch1979]

Ok, thank you. The tip definitely has been added in a workshop.

 

 

[LauraMedea]

1 hour ago, Fitch1979 said:

Ok, thank you. The tip definitely has been added in a workshop.

 

 

Oky, thanks a lot for your response! Is there anything I can do to bring it back to as natural as possible without ruining the piece? I don't want to make a mess since the reconstructed part is quite small compared to the rest of the tooth and I would hate to destroy it, but if there is some simple method to clean it from human intervention maybe it can be done!

[Fitch1979]

Thing is the original part is not there. To restore it, you should undo the former restoration and do a better one yourself. It can be done, but would take a bit of experience to do it right. 

 

I d suggest you would find a new owner for this tooth. Someone that is OK with a restoration like this (if you give, sell or trade the tooth is entirely up to you). And find yourself a new better one to your liking.

 

Best regards 

[LauraMedea]

52 minutes ago, Fitch1979 said:

Thing is the original part is not there. To restore it, you should undo the former restoration and do a better one yourself. It can be done, but would take a bit of experience to do it right. 

 

I d suggest you would find a new owner for this tooth. Someone that is OK with a restoration like this (if you give, sell or trade the tooth is entirely up to you). And find yourself a new better one to your liking.

 

Best regards 

For now I think I'll keep it, after all it's my first tooth and I'm getting fond of it😅, furthermore apart from that reconstructed portion, the rest is ok, it's a rather large tooth and I didn't spend a lot so it could have been much worse given my ignorance about fossils. There will be other opportunities to find other completely natural teeth without restorations/reconstructions and I hope to seize them perhaps by asking you for an opinion first. Thanks so much for your help,

Best Regards 

[Randyw]

41 minutes ago, LauraMedea said:

For now I think I'll keep it, after all it's my first tooth and I'm getting fond of it😅

I would. If you’re happy with it and you feel you got a good deal then you did. I wouldnt try to take apart the reconstructed piece becuase I don’t think you’ll be as happy with it as you are now. If it was in my collection I’d display it as is. I know I’d be happy with it in my collection.

[Fitch1979]

Besides.. restorations are not always a bad thing. Happy WE