teeth

[NORFOLK BOY]

Hi all,

just a quick try at downloading an image I found on my computer to see if I could get image up, if this works then theres lots more to come ur way!

Edited September 16, 2007 by Anson

[Uncle Siphuncle]

Cool mammoth and horse teeth.  Did you find these yourself or get them from one of the fishing boats in the North Sea?

[NORFOLK BOY]

Hi Dan,

all my collection has been found by me off the beaches in my area, have never purchased a fossil in my life! I get lots of excercise walking the beaches regular with my dog, I hardly ever come back with nothing but a majoritory is bone fragments with the odd irratic ammo. Here is a picture of a bit of my coast which is suffering errosion badly at the moment.

Edited September 16, 2007 by Anson

[Gatorman]

Very Cool show us more  ;D

[worthy 55]

Outstanding!!!! Norfork 8) 8) 8)

[Uncle Siphuncle]

Very impressive.  I have yet to score a decent mammoth tooth here in Texas.  I don't buy fossils either since I like the thrill of making my own finds and I only have room in my house for personal finds.  I understand however if others like to buy and trade.  Heck I may need to sell off some extras soon to make room and finance future trips.

[Harry Pristis]

What do you do with all those echinoids, Dan?  I'd like to have a set of Texas echinoids

for my comparison collection.

------Harry Pristis

[Uncle Siphuncle]

Harry

Fortunately prepped echies don't require much space.  Since many of them come from construction sites I've been stockpiling them while they are available for future disposition.  I've donated some A grade stuff to museums and B and C grade stuff to high schools, Boy Scouts, etc. and taken the tax writeoff.  There have been isolated situations where I've been able to trade good specimens for productive, little known site info within a 300 mile radius of San Antonio, which is probably my favorite use of surplus specimens.  "My roof ain't leakin'," so I haven't sold anything to date, but I'll probably begin doing so at Fossilmania and/or eBay sometime soon, not really to profit per se, but to pay for fuel and vehicle maintenance (I probably log 15-20K miles per year for fossils alone) while making space for more variety in my collection.  Some specimens are rarely seen but when a good exposure is found they are available in surplus quantities, and my top priority is always finding virgin or little known exposures.  So if I let uncommon stuff out on eBay at a controlled rate I may be able to peddle some echies, crabs, etc. for years to come even after the good exposures are long gone.

[Harry Pristis]

Well, Dan, I see you have a plan to market your echinoids. I think you're doing the right thing.

The idea that it is somehow shameful to make a profit--to buy and sell fossils--is professional paleontologist propaganda.  It is particularly obnoxious among vertebrate paleontologists.  The notion is an "attitude" that doesn't stand up under rational examination.  No one should feel awkward about wanting compensation for time invested, expenses of collecting, or preparation of fossils.

What I was asking is, What would it take to get a representative collection (whatever that may be -six -twelve -twenty) of Texas echinoids from you today?

-----Harry Pristis

[Uncle Siphuncle]

Harry

What I've seen on eBay and at shows is a wide range of prices based on species, size within species and condition as one might expect.  If the seller knows positive ID and provides formation and county info the specimens tend to more significant that if not, again as you would expect.  Regular (radially symmetrical) echies tend to command a higher price than irregular (heart shaped) echies.  In general I've seen some of the more common echies with perhaps a few flaws yet still easily identifiable to species and still of interest to experienced collectors tend to go for about $5-$10, perfect examples of species that are locally abundant somewhere in the state roughly $10-$20, exotics $20-$50, and super exotics never seen on eBay can sell at shows for $50-$400+.  Most folks who pursue rare fossils strictly for the thrill of it all don't put the ultra high end stuff on the market, but it sounds like that's not what you are looking for.  The funny thing for collectors not familiar with this material is that in some cases a rare specimen can look quite like a common one until diagnostic features are scrutinized (relative size and position of ambulacra, pore and tubercle distribution, relative size and position of peristome and periproct, etc).

Just let me know how rare, how many species, and what condition you are interested in and I'll put some hi res images in front of you for scrutiny.

[Harry Pristis]

I've prepared and sold many Florida echinoids, Dan. In Florida, you can't get 50 cents for an imperfect specimen; is it different for Texas echinoids?

Of course, rarity is a factor. I do have two or three Florida echinoids in my drawer that I wish were perfect. The rule is, Keep the best one you can find.

Don't send me high res images, Dan. I am using a dial-up connection which slows the loading of the big images too much. I like regular echinoids. What do you have?

----------Harry Pristis

[NORFOLK BOY]

  Hi all,

  on the subject of echinoids I do have quite a big collection of them from the chalk exposures in my area formed from flint, not really into them as they are quite common of the beach and most tend to be worn from being tumbled by the sea. I did find 3 yesterday 3inch diameter and left them there for someone else to find.

    I have 9 mammoth teeth in my collection so far from straight tusk elephant, steppe mammoth, wooly mammoth. Now the Winter is looming collecting should pick up.

    If anyone interested I could post a few pics up of some and probably trade a few.

      Si

[NORFOLK BOY]

  just read my last jottings, oops it may give the impression i have mammoth teeth to trade.... fraid not I meant echinoids! Sorry for that.

    Si

[Harry Pristis]

Hello, Si . . .

I'm always interested in adding a few echinoids to my drawer.  They don't have to be rare, but they should be excellent examples.  I have an air-abrasive machine to prepare them.

I don't have many invertebrate fossils from the chalk.  I have a few from the Continent which I picked up when doing shows at Ste. Marie aux Mines, Alsace.

What is it that you'd like to have from the USA?

-----Harry Pristis

[NORFOLK BOY]

  Hi Harry,

    will put up a few of my best and see what you think, may take me a day or two.

    Si

[Mike Owens]

Harry,

    Make yourself a notation to contact me in mid October. When the tempertue gets into the mid '80's or lower, I am going to retrieve my collection from my shed. I will find you a nice Texas echinoid & send it to you. My E Mail is: mowens41usa@webtv.net.

Mike

[Harry Pristis]

That's mighty neighborly of you, Mike.

I know what you mean about the temperature.  It's been brutal.

I used to live in San Antonio and San Angelo, but that was before I started collecting fossils. 

I did mount a collecting trip to West Texas after I moved to Florida, but didn't get much from the Comanchean Series Limestone out there.  I surely enjoyed seeing Trans-Pecos Texas again, though.

I'll make a note.

------Harry Pristis

[Uncle Siphuncle]

Harry

Have a look at some of these.

Archaeocidaris is a cool Pennsylvanian echinoid with remarkable preservation. This lagerstatte is preserved in the friable black Winchell shale at the Lake Brownwood Spillway. Finding them isn't a problem. Digging back into the sheer wall to take out crumbling slabs big enough to have intact specimens while slaving away in the TX sun and then latter taking the time to prep them with a microblaster is where the effort comes into play. This site is about a 400 mile round trip for me.

Hemiaster bexari is a cool little spatangoid from the rarely exposed Corsicana fm (67 MYA) of South TX. I've taken more than I need from this site and pulled in a couple museums due to the significant and diverse fauna found there. Just yesterday I was asked by the MS Museum of Natural History to coauthor a paper on Upper K echinoid distribution of the Gulf Coastal Plain. I plan to help out by doing soil samples of various lithologies as well as guiding museum personnel and providing statistical information from specimens in my collection. I have enough perfect specimens that if I release some I won't hurt my collection or the museum deal. Diagnostic features include ambulacral fasciole, scrobiculated tubercles, short ambs considerably shorter than long ambs, test truncated posteriorly, and generally globose form. This species can be locally abundant but good exposures are so scarce that few collectors have them or have even heard of them. This fortunately is one of the few spectacular sites I've found close to home.

Loriolia rosana is a fairly common regular echie from the Upper Glen Rose fm (108 MYA) of south and central TX. Like many echies from this formation, you have to go through lots of uglies to find the gooduns. These were found within a 50-75 mile round trip from SA.

Salenia phillipsae is a rare Glen Rose echie available at only one site I know of that is now posted but I have permission from the landowner. These things are usually small (5 mm) and perfectly preserved. Luckily this site is a 75 mile round trip for me.

Salenia texana is the largest of the genus I've seen in TX. They are usually 15-25 mm in diameter. I've taken a number of perfect ones from now covered construction sites within a half our of home. They are sought after by TX collectors. I often see ugly ones on eBay for $3.

Phymosoma texanum is a beautiful regular echie from the Walnut fm (105 MYA) of Central TX. Perfect ones often draw $30-$40 a pop at shows. Again you have to go through lots of boogered ones to get the better ones. They present a 300-400 mile round trip for me.

Salenia mexicana generally shows up at or near the same sites as P. texanum and also is a staple of many TX echinoid collections.

Not shown is the tiny test of Goniophorus scotti, a scarce but cool little regular echie from the Grayson fm of North Central TX. A buddy found a localized pocket of these things and we bulk sampled it pretty thoroughly. I'm still going through bulk samples and pulling out these 1-1.5 mm tests. You'd really need a microscope to appreciate them but preservation is quite good.

You mentioned West TX - I've done OK in the Boracho fm between Fort Stockton and El Paso on Anorthopygus, Globator, Dumblea, Coenholectypus, Macraster, Holaster, Salenia, Goniopygus, Phymosoma, and Heteraster echinoids. Although echies were abundant it was tough work - 800 miles round trip, using a 21 foot extension ladder solo in highway road cuts, etc. I had a blast a couple times but it sure was hard on the body doing 800 miles of driving plus 10-12 hours of collecting and being home within 24 hours.

Edited September 16, 2007 by Anson

[Guest Guest_Harry Pristis_*]

Harry

Have a look at some of these. . . .

You mentioned West TX - I've done OK in the Boracho fm between Fort Stockton and El Paso on Anorthopygus, Globator, Dumblea, Coenholectypus, Macraster, Holaster, Salenia, Goniopygus, Phymosoma, and Heteraster echinoids.  Although echies were abundant it was tough work - 800 miles round trip, using a 21 foot extension ladder solo in highway road cuts, etc.  I had a blast a couple times but it sure was hard on the body doing 800 miles of driving plus 10-12 hours of collecting and being home within 24 hours.

Thanks for the info on the echinoids, Dan. No images loaded on this thread, though.

I have three Texas echinoids in my drawer: one Globator perryi and two unidentified regular urchins. All are from the Boracho Fm, Levinson Member, Culberson County. I think these are from my collecting trip out there (a long time ago).

An extension ladder -- that must have earned you lots of horn-honks from passing motorists! I admire your ingenuity and determination! My own collecting was a bit less intense.

I'll look forward to seeing your pix.

---------Harry Pristis

[Harry Pristis]

Thanks for the info on the echinoids, Dan. No images loaded on this thread, though.

. . .

I'll look forward to seeing your pix.

---------Harry Pristis

Now I can see the pix, Dan. Very nice echinoids there . . . it must be a thrill each time you pick up one.

If you can pick out a few (4 or 5) that you can spare, let me know what you want for them. I'm interested in a representative group, not systematics. Quality is more important to me than rarity.

-----Harry Pristis