SeaGee Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Hi, A friend found this while we were fossil hunting in SW FL. Does anyone know of a website that I could submit this to for identification, or any other resources that may help? thanks a lot, SeaGee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bmorefossil Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Hi, A friend found this while we were fossil hunting in SW FL. Does anyone know of a website that I could submit this to for identification, or any other resources that may help? thanks a lot, SeaGee are you just looking for info on who made it or are you looking for more than that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makoken Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Hi, A friend found this while we were fossil hunting in SW FL. Does anyone know of a website that I could submit this to for identification, or any other resources that may help? thanks a lot, SeaGee Nice point. A good book is "Stone Age Spear and Arrow Points" A modern survey and reference. By Noel D. Justice. I'll look thru it, and see if I can find something similar from your region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaGee Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 are you just looking for info on who made it or are you looking for more than that? Bmore, any and all info i can get...who made it, when, if it is incomplete/broken. SeaGee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaGee Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 Nice point. A good book is "Stone Age Spear and Arrow Points" A modern survey and reference. By Noel D. Justice. I'll look thru it, and see if I can find something similar from your region. thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 There are some knowledgeable artifact collectors right here; stay tuned for thr responses "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2gould Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Try arrowheadforums.com. They are very nice and extremely knowledgable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenixflood Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Given the diagonal angle of the bottom end, I would say it was broken but that answer would be dependent on whether of not that end was knapped or just flat at the break. If the rock seems to come together like it does on the blade end, I'd change my opinion. If you look at it at eye level the stone, where the shaft would have gone, it should converge together if it's complete (like this <, if not you'll see a surface that's like this [ As to what tribe made it ??? The soul of a Fossil Hunter is one that is seeking, always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pristiformes Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 In addition to the stuff already mentioned regarding projectile points, I would suggest looking at Robin Brown's book Florida's First People, which has a number of points labeled in figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bmorefossil Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Given the diagonal angle of the bottom end, I would say it was broken but that answer would be dependent on whether of not that end was knapped or just flat at the break. If the rock seems to come together like it does on the blade end, I'd change my opinion. If you look at it at eye level the stone, where the shaft would have gone, it should converge together if it's complete (like this <, if not you'll see a surface that's like this [ As to what tribe made it ??? Phoenixflood from looking at the picture it seems to look like this where the shaft would have gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Phoenixflood from looking at the picture it seems to look like this where the shaft would have gone. I am skeptical that this was ever a spear-point. A pre-form, perhaps. It looks to me to be percussion flaked. If it were a pre-form that snapped in two, it appears that the "snap" may have been worked to produce a graver spur. Such tools are called "spokeshaves" in the Florida typology. It is thought that these tools were used to work wood and bone. Your tool seems to be well-made, and in good condition -- unused, as far as I can see. http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaGee Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 thanks everyone for all the input the "shaft end" is definately not shaped like this...[... it appears to have a bit of fluting, but not as much as I have seen in other points. I'll definitely check out the references mentioned above thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenixflood Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Phoenixflood from looking at the picture it seems to look like this where the shaft would have gone. Yes, yes Bmore. I was trying to describe a different angle than the one seen in this picture, not well enough I suppose, where if one were to pick it up and look where the shaft connected. If you rotated it 90 degrees and then brought it up to eye level you'd be able to see if it was broken or not which he says it's not. Normally if it is broken you will not see a fluted edge. And Harry seems to have nailed what it really is. Very cool find! The soul of a Fossil Hunter is one that is seeking, always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bmorefossil Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Yes, yes Bmore. I was trying to describe a different angle than the one seen in this picture, not well enough I suppose, where if one were to pick it up and look where the shaft connected. If you rotated it 90 degrees and then brought it up to eye level you'd be able to see if it was broken or not which he says it's not. Normally if it is broken you will not see a fluted edge. And Harry seems to have nailed what it really is. Very cool find! ah i see what your saying now, sorry about that im still learning about artifacts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenixflood Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 ah i see what your saying now, sorry about that im still learning about artifacts. No problem, I wasn't trying to be harsh or anything. I'm sorry if you took it that way. I must not have explained what I meant the first time very well. Yeah, I'm still learning a lot about artifacts as well. I haven't found too many. I don't think that there are too many places here in MD to look, although they do pop up every now and again. I've really only have found 2 points will I was fossil hunting but one was a nice savannah river point 5" in NC. The soul of a Fossil Hunter is one that is seeking, always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bmorefossil Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 No problem, I wasn't trying to be harsh or anything. I'm sorry if you took it that way. I must not have explained what I meant the first time very well.Yeah, I'm still learning a lot about artifacts as well. I haven't found too many. I don't think that there are too many places here in MD to look, although they do pop up every now and again. I've really only have found 2 points will I was fossil hunting but one was a nice savannah river point 5" in NC. no I didnt take it the wrong way lol, yea i only have 2 points as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverphoenix Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Looks like either a preform or a blade of some sort. Looks complete to me. Perhaps unfinished though--would have to see wear on edges to know for sure which of the two it is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makoken Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 How about an Early Triangular, Early Archaic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 How about an Early Triangular, Early Archaic? Spokeshaves have been around for a long time -- they were part of the Paleo-Indian tool-kit. The further south you go in Florida, the fewer lithic artifacts there are to be found and the younger they may be. If this tool is from the Peace River, it is more likely to be "Florida Transitional" in age (1200 - 500 BC in Bullen's typology). Out of context, though, it is difficult to put an absolute age on many tools. Here is my favorite tool from the Peace River. It's made from a chunk of agatized coral from the Tampa Limestone (25 Ma) exposed in the area. In the Tampa Bay Area, such coral heads may be geodized, lined with botryoidal quartz or drusy quartz crystals. http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I am skeptical that this was ever a spear-point. A pre-form, perhaps. It looks to me to be percussion flaked..... From my experience, I think Harry is correct. It appears this artifact was broken when it was being made. The short "step" flake near the round end may have been the cause. Sometimes a misplaced strike, in the course of manufacturing, sends a shock wave through the pre-form and snaps the tool at it's weakest point. This usually occurs during the percussion flaking process that Harry alluded too. Depending, on who was making it, the "pieces" could be made into tools, or skipped across the river. In the pre-form stage, it can be very hard to assign a certain point style, or "type" to a broken artifact. To determine age, point or blade styles close in size and geographic distribution would be your "best guess". It is pre-historic...it wasn't made by any of the historic tribes. That said, your small piece of stone still has a real story with real people...and now you're part of it. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracer Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 i got to see a really good and really fast percussion flaker work one time, and it was magic. it was unbelievable to me that he could do what he was doing. it was like he could rapidly whack a piece of chert a hundred times and a perfect point would jump out of it. bordered on ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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